mychemigirl

Thank you all for being open to other perspectives other than your own and taking the time to read this. I respect all of you as individuals and know that some of this may offend you, but I want all of you to know this because I care about all of you. You are all wonderful people that deserve to know the truth.

I really appreciate you asking me about this.

But it’s not about me!

Now let’s see… Hm… Well, I figured that I’d try to answer everyone’s questions. I don’t have all the answers, though. I’m just a follower of God. This is what God has to say about homosexuality.


Xdmltnxlover says:
“The bible might say that God "Will accept you for who you are." And then later in the bible it says "He didn't make us to like the same gender" We like who we like. That's like people saying God made Adam and Eve NOT Adam and Steve.”

--Again, I’d like to point out that the Bible never says that God will “accept you for who you are.” If it did, I imagine it might go something like this:


God: So, Sam. How come you didn’t do what I asked you to do?
Sam: Well… I know you said not to steal that CD, and not to lie about it… but, hey, I am who I am.
God: Oh, that’s right. Nevermind me.

There are major problems with that! And also, about the “Adam and Steve” thing, I don’t understand how that makes sense to anybody. As everyone hopefully knows, God did make Adam and Eve, so how that is even an arguable statement I will never know.


ZERO’s questions:
“The Bible says alot of things…Alot of things that contradict what was said a couple chapters back. And plus, the Bible says “Thou Shall Not Kill” but riddle me this the Christians started the Crussades did the not?”

--No one ever said that the Crusades were the Will of God. It’s been a while since I studied the Crusades, but I do know about some of the wars that took place in the Old Testament.

Deuteronomy 7:1-2 says: “When the Lord your God brings you into the land you are entering to possess and drives out before you many nations—the Hittites, Girgashites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites, seven nations larger and stronger than you—and when the Lord your God has delivered them over to you and you have defeated them, then you must destroy them totally. Make no treaty with them, and show them no mercy.”

Here, God is commanding the Israelites to go to war with other nations both larger and stronger than them. And not just to go to war with them, but to destroy them totally.

--Many, many people get confused when it comes to the Ten Commandments saying, “You shall not murder,” vs. “You shall not kill.” People say, “Murder, kill—same thing.” Actually, murdering and killing are two completely different things. If the Bible said, “Do not kill,” and you stepped on an ant one day, you killed, right? In Genesis, God said that man is to have dominion over all the animals, which means that we can eat them. Well, we wouldn’t be able to eat them if we couldn’t kill them. And an even larger example! When God called his people to offer up sacrifices to him, such as lambs, people would be killing them, too. How would that work? In the Ten Commandments, God says, “You shall not murder.” Murdering is killing something or someone for your own selfish desires, such as for revenge. In fact, the Bible is for the death penalty (Numbers 35:31).

“It also says as you stated(mychemgirl) that "A man shall not lie with another man" Clearly implying intercorse should not take place. Nothing about wich you prefer to have feelings for. Though being a virgin for the rest of your life isn't too thrilling. But after all, He's a forgiving God right?”

--C’mon, guys, let’s not act stupid. This verse it talking about being gay. The reason God created sex was for reproduction. You’re not supposed to have sex with random people because then you’ll be having kids all the time. That’s why you’re supposed to only have sex with the person you’re married to—the person you’ve pledged to live forever with. That person is the person you love and care for and want to start a family with. Men can’t reproduce among themselves. Sex isn’t about expressing just how much you “feel” for another person, it’s about starting a family. Gay sex is defying God’s Master Plan. The Bible is very black and white when it comes to homosexuality.

Leviticus 18:22 is one of the nicer verses.
- “Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable.”

Leviticus 20:13—not so much.
- “If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.”

In fact, the Bible is so persistent on homosexuality being a sin that it talks about it in both the Old and New Testaments.

Romans 1:24-32 says that homosexuality is unnatural.
- “Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.
“Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.” (sexual diseases)
“Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought to be done. They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless. Although they know God’s righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.”

Talk about ouch.

1 Corinthians 6:9-10 is the big one.
- “Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor the idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.”


God isn’t playing around. Eternity is at stake here, guys.

--God is a forgiving God, but in order to truly be sorry for something, you’ve got to mean it. Being gay is ignoring the fact that He demands us not to be, yet saying, “Oh, sorry. Forgive me?” then continuing in our acts. He knows our hearts.

“And it is possible for a woman to have children wihout a man being there in fleshy form. It's called stem. That men can donate to a hospital or facility and a woman can use without really having the male present. Or for the men's factor , or the woman's, you could always adopt.”

--That is society finding ways to work with homosexuality. To let you know, stem cells have nothing to do with reproduction. Stem cells are cells attained from your spinal column and used to identify your genetic make-up. Stem cells are used in cloning. Sperm is what men donate to hospitals. But think about it: could you get sperm implanted in you fifty years ago? No. Forty years ago? Again, the answer is no. You know why? Because it is unnatural.

--Adopting is not creating more humans, it’s just claiming the ones already created.

__________________



The sun goes down…

mychemigirl

Kyo’s questions/comments:

“So God made Adam and Eve, right? Too my knowledge, they had kids. And to make more people, the kids had sex with each other, right? I mean it's the only possible solution.

WAIT!

So you're telling me we're all created from incests! Omg.”

--You’re absolutely correct. We’re all like one big family. Feel the love? Genesis 5 is about Adam’s descendants. In that chapter, you can see that a lot of time passes. In fact, one man, Methuselah, lived to be 969 years old. How? Well, think about it. Back then, the earth was fresh and new. You didn’t have to worry about pesticides and Trans fats and all the stuff that we have now. In that passing time of Genesis 5, there was plenty of time for families to be made. If every couple had about five children, that would be several thousand people in a rather short amount of time. But then you think about different races and how they came to be. Microevolution. Microevolution is the belief that different traits can come about through selective breeding and such, which is true. It’s like how we get different breeds of dogs and cats. Macroevolution is the belief that, say, a fish could become a dog after several thousand years, which is false.

“And oh, I'd like to point out the bible's been translated so many times - how do you know your version is right?”

--The Bible has been translated many times—I won’t argue with that. But all the translations mean the same thing. For example, look at what John 1:1-2 brings up:

New American Standard Bible:
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God.

Amplified Bible:
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God Himself. He was present originally with God.

New International Version:
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning.

The Message:
The Word was first, the Word present to God, God present to the Word. The Word was God, in readiness for God from day one.

There are many more translations, but you get the gist of what I was trying to say. Even though there are some changes in wording, they all say virtually the same thing.

__________________



The sun goes down…

mychemigirl

“And also, the bible isn't written by God, but by his followers, who just by coincendence lived in towns where women were frowned upon and seen below men - sound like the bible much? Exactly! I think we all know the bibles made up of stuff that people, at the time thought made sense for THAT TIME. Because a lot of things didn't made sense back then - like they thought the world was flat =/ They thought a lot of things which were proved wrong now, because with technology, and proofs, we can disprove a lot of their logic back then.”

--Ah, but the Bible is written by God! The Bible is God-breathed, or God-inspired, which means that God wrote it. In the Bible, man is talked about as wicked and self-satisfying. Would a regular average Joe talk about himself in that manner? Of course not. He would be glorifying himself—talking about how wonderful he is.

--Women weren’t frowned upon at all! God used women to achieve what he wanted. Actually, Genesis 1:27 says that women are equal with men.

It says: “So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.”

Not only are women equal, but some women were commended for leading the church (Romans 16:1-2).

It says: “I commend to you our sister Phoebe, a servant of the church in Cenchrea. I ask you to receive her in the Lord in a way worthy of the saints and to give her any help she may need from you, for she has been a great help to many people, including me.”

Paul was sending this letter to the church at Rome and most likely wrote this book between 56-58 AD.

However, the Bible does say that women are to submit to their husbands (Ephesians 5:22). But the husbands have to love their wives just as Christ loved the church (Ephesians 5:25). That, my friends, is very, very hard to do. Now, I don’t think you realize just how much Christ loved the church. He was crucified for it.

This is what a crucifixion entails:

In the early morning, he was battered and bruised, dehydrated, and exhausted from a sleepless night.
In preparation for being scourged, he was stripped of his clothing and his hands were tied to a post above his head.
A Roman legionnaire stepped forward with a flagrum (or flagellum) in his hand. http://www.bible-history.com/past/images/flagrum.gif
This is a short whip consisting of several heavy leather thongs with small balls of lead attached near the ends of each. The heavy whip was brought down with full force repeatedly across his back, shoulders, and legs. At first, the thongs cut through skin only. Then, as the blows continued, they cut deeper into the subcutaneous tissues, producing first an oozing blood from the capillaries and veins of the skin, and finally spurting arterial blood from vessels in the underlying muscles. Finally, the skin of the back was hanging in long ribbons, and the entire back area was an unrecognizable mess of torn, bleeding tissue. When it was determined by the centurion in charge that the Prisoner was near death, the beating finally stopped.
He was then untied and allowed to slump to the stone pavement, wet from his own blood.
Roman soldiers laughed at him and mocked him. They threw a robe across his shoulders and thrust a stick into his hands as a scepter. Flexible branches with long thorns were formed to make a crown shape, then pushed down into his scalp, and again there is copious bleeding as the scalp is one of the most vascular areas of the body.
After mocking him and striking him across the face, the soldiers took the stick from his hand and smashed it down on his head, driving the thorns from his “crown” deeper into his head.
Finally, they got tired of this sadistic joke and ripped the robe from his back.
Having already adhered to the clots of blood and serum in the wounds, its removal caused excruciating pain, just like as if you ripped off a surgical bandage, and almost as though he were again be whipped, the wounds once more began to bleed.
His articles of clothing were returned to him.
The heavy cross was tied across his shoulders, and soon after, he began the walk along the Via Dolorosa.
Although he tried to walk erect, the weight of the wooden beam, along with the abundant blood loss, was too much. He stumbled and fell. The rough wood of the beam gouged into the lacerated skin and muscles of the shoulders. He tried to rise, but his muscles were pushed beyond their endurance.
The centurion, anxious to get on with the crucifixion, selected a stalwart North African onlooker, Simon of Cyrene, to carry the cross. Jesus followed, still bleeding and sweating the cold, clammy sweat of shock, until the 650 yard journey from the fortress Antonia to Golgotha was finally completed.
Simon was ordered to place the cross on the ground, and Jesus was thrown against the back of the wood.
The legionnaire felt for depression at the front of a wrist, and drove a heavy, square, wrought-iron nail into the skin and deep into the wood. He did this again to the other arm.
His left foot was then pressed backward against the right foot, and with both feet extended, toes down, a nail was driven through the arch of each, leaving the knees slightly flexed.
He was then crucified.
As he slowly sagged down with more weight on the nails in the wrists, excruciating pain shot along the fingers and up the arms exploding in the brain—the nails in the wrists were putting pressure on the median nerves.
As he pushed himself upward to avoid this stretching torment, he placed his full weight on the nail through his feet. Again, there was the searing agony of the nail tearing through the nerves between the metatarsal bones of the feet.
At that point, as the arms fatigued, great waves of cramps swept over the muscles, knotting them into deep, relentless, throbbing pain. With those cramps came the inability to push himself upward. Hanging by his arms, the pectoral muscles were paralyzed and the intercostals muscles were unable to act. Air could be drawn into the lungs, but not exhaled.
He fought to raise himself in order to get even one short breath. Finally, carbon dioxide built up in the lungs and in the blood stream, and the cramps temporarily subsided.
Spasmodically, he was able to push himself to exhale and utter his last few sentences.
Hours of limitless pain, cycles of twisting, joint-rending cramps, intermittent partial asphyxiation, searing pain from where tissue was torn from his lacerated back as he moved up and down the rough timber.
Then another agony began—a terrible crushing pain deep in his chest as the pericardium slowly filled with serum and began to compress the heart.

And finally, he died.


Someone please explain to me how that is moral—how you would possibly find that in a book of morals.
You wouldn’t. You don’t.

--And about the fact that people thought the world was flat, well, great example. Isaiah 40:22 clearly states that the earth is a circle, or sphere.

--Could you please tell me what these “proofs” are?

__________________



The sun goes down…

mychemigirl

“So now, let me ask a question. We had so many miracle's back then in the bible, stating that this and that happened! I mean, one story is the fish one, where Jesus handed out with one fish, fed like a hundred people? Now why don't they come about now?

Why did they get miracles? Even miracles after Jesus had died too. So it wasn't like Jesus made them ALL.

And, also I'm not talking about miracles where someone jumps off a cliff and survives. I mean a miracle where someone creates water in to wine or brings frogs from the sky. Why don't they happen now? BECAUSE WE CAN DISPROVE THEM, obviously.”

--Jesus fed five thousand people. Yes, it was a miracle. It wasn’t fake. Just because something out of the ordinary happened doesn’t mean that it wasn’t real. Take Criss Angel, for example. People believe that he’s really skilled at what he does. Now, I’m not saying that Criss is Jesus or anything, I’m just saying that people believe him now. How is what he does any different from what Jesus did? Just because we can’t see it now doesn’t mean that it never happened.

--And how can you disprove what happened? Please explain. I’d very much like to hear.

“Back then they'd believe anything!”

--And HOW is that any different from now? Just because people lived in older times than we do doesn’t mean that they were stupid. Do you think that talk of someone turning water into wine was normal? Do you think guys just sat around on their work break, catching up on each others’ lives when someone said, “Hey, did you hear that guy Jesus turned water into wine a couple nights ago?” and someone replied, “Really? That’s cool. So how are your kids?” No way! People would be shocked, just like we would be.

“Also, why can't people love WHO they want to love? Obviously, if God created us all, why did he even bother creating homosexuals? And didn't he say he loved ALL his children? Why does loving the same sex count as a sin, is it hurting anyone? Seriously, concentrate on the people that DO cause harm. Like peado's and murderers.”

--First of all, the world is not up to us. God created the world, he created us, he created our whole way of living. He runs the show here, not us. He says don’t be gay, then don’t be gay. We owe him that much after all that he’s done for us. Don’t know exactly what that is? Read what exactly goes into a crucifixion above.

--Second of all, God didn’t create homosexuals. Being homosexual is a choice, just like it is to murder someone or rob a bank. Remember when your parents told you not to do something and you did it anyway? That was a choice. You made a poor choice, and you got punished for it. God doesn’t create people that are intentionally meant to sin. They make their own choices. If they choose to ignore the consequences now, then they’ll just get it harsher in the future.

“And also, by your logic, we're only here to create babies. Well, whats the point in jobs? Whats the point in lives at all! Thats because you're wrong, we're not here to JUST make kids, we're here to have life, to have creation. There's more to life than just multiplying. And also, it sounds wrong to say that just because male and females can have kids, it makes it right. What about women that CAN'T have kids? Are they sin too? Ya'know, when they're born with defects that makes them so they can't get pregnant, is that sin? Because we are born gay afterall, so we're in the same boat, basically.”

--No, I never said that we are here only to create children. There is a point in jobs, in working hard. The Bible makes that very clear. We are to work in life and not be lazy, but to also have fun. God wants us to have lives! He wants us to be happy! Believe me, if he wanted us to be clones that did whatever the hell he wanted us to do, he would have done so. But he gave us free will so we could make our own choices, no matter how much it hurt him to see us disobey him after everything he had created for us. God has a plan for everyone’s life. Everyone has a chance to get their happy ever after. It may not be what you had in mind, but it’s what God knows will make you happiest in the long run. He just wants us to be happy, but he wants to be thanked for what he’s done.

You don’t give a gift to someone on their birthday after hand-crafting it and putting your time into it and wrapping it and delivering it only to get a, “Yeah, sure, whatever. Set it by the door. I’ll get it later.” You want a thank you! You want to know that the person you gave your gift to is thankful for what you’ve done, or even recognizing that you made it. It’s the same way with God.

--God created women who can’t get pregnant just as special as the rest of us. Maybe they weren’t supposed to have kids. They aren’t a sin. God doesn’t make “sins”. He makes people. Just because someone doesn’t have the killer smile, the gorgeous good looks and the amazing body doesn’t mean that they aren’t as good as the people who were blessed with all those qualities. We are all equal. Like I said, just because their happy ever after isn’t what they had in mind doesn’t mean that they’re not going to get one. If they just put their faith in God and trust that he knows what he’s doing, not us, we’d be a lot happier. I don’t know about all of you, but I’d rather trust someone who’s never made a single mistake over me, who’s made plenty of them.

--And no one is born gay. Ever. God doesn’t create gay people, man does.

__________________



The sun goes down…

mychemigirl

something’s questions:


“I have a feeling i'm Bi.....and it's just so wrong to think you should live your life with someone you DON'T love just so you can have children, you should be with who you love no mater what, and really if god hated gay people SOOO much then why doesn't he do any thing about it! gah”

--God doesn’t do anything about it because he gave us free will. He could wipe out the entire population of the world if he wanted to. Believe me, he’s done it before. (Noah’s ark). With free will, we have the ability to make our own choices and be who we want to be. God gave us free will to see who would choose him and who wouldn’t. Homosexuals…don’t. And it’s sad.



Please understand, guys, that I’m not trying to fix you. I’m not trying to cure you. I’m just trying to help you. I don’t have all the answers. I’m just a follower of God.

However, I’m going to share something personal with you guys.

Last week, I felt something inside of me. It was odd, strange…calming. I knew it was God. I’ve been a Christian since I was three, and I’ve never felt anything like this…ever. I never did at Hume Lake, I never did at church, I never did at Bible study. It was random—unexpected—but I knew exactly what it was. It was God—no doubt about it. Guys, when you get that feeling, it’s the best thing in the world. You feel like you can conquer the world with God, fly to the stars with God… it’s fantastic. It’s like a breeze just blew through your soul and washed away all your worries. It’s kind of hard to explain, but I just felt at peace. I felt calm and placid. I felt happy.

I want to let you know that I, as a Christian, don’t picture myself as better than you. I don’t think that I’m somehow in a higher rank than you. I am a sinner. You’re a sinner. We’re all sinners. We all make mistakes, and mine aren’t any better than yours.

I respect all of you, each and every one of you. You all deserve a chance to live and be happy. I don’t deserve it any more than you do.

Thank you, and if you have any questions, you can ask me. My friend, Troy, and I are very excited about this.

xo,
Jenn

__________________



The sun goes down…

Don Ricalo

You do realise you're trying to claim that a man escaped death and lived 969 years because of fresh air?
You're a bit fucking mental, tbh.
If such a thing was possible, why have we not found these thousands of 900 year old skeletons? Or was he just a one off so we've no chance of actually proving it, just like everything else to do with Religion?

You are completely delusional. Idiotically blinded by faith and false beliefs.

Also, you're only quoting bibles that are in English, what I'd imagine was meant was translations from other languages, ancient languages that weren't known well enough when those versions were translated to have been done so, as predictably, things would get changed. Do this a few times and voila, new bible verse!

The complete and utter ignorance of any common sense when it comes to Religion astounds me, it really does.

__________________

Sabeline

Hey, Richard, give it a rest. Seriously. Everyone was really anxious in the other thread that she treat OUR beliefs with respect, and that goes both ways. Stating your opinion is one thing; calling her insane for her faith is too far.

Mychemigirl; I'm so tired tonight I can hardly think straight, so I'm not going to give a proper answer right now. There are a lot of points in your argument that I disagree with and a whole lot of holes in the logic - I mean the whole theology, not your argument specifically. You bring up some good points, but as I said I disagree, and I'm currently incapable of presenting my own opinion in any coherent manner. XD I just thought I'd post to thank you for the time you've obviously taken in preparing this, and that I'll give it another proper read and respond properly when I'm a little less zombified.

And before any more posts like Richard's appear...can we PLEASE try to keep this thread friendly? I know religion is a controversial topic, but when we suggested this thread I don't think any of us wanted it to turn into a fight or a preaching ground.

__________________
The zombies are coming!!



Proud owner of mini Morrissey!

Amphetamine Logic - My fanfiction! Please read!
Killer Queen - Frerard Onehot
My Poetry Thread

My Graphics Thread

Proud member of the Loser Crew!
Baddass Alien Crew - finally a stereotype I can identify with!
Discover-Gee Crew FTW!!!
Hug Mikey - Blame Emma Crew! Just in case...

Don Ricalo

I'm stating my opinion.
Freedom of speech, gotta love it.

I've no problem with Christianity, or any Religion for that matter, until they start replying with insane claims without rational reasoning. I realise I've already mentioned freedom of speech and this is hers, but merely saying "Because God/the bible said so" isn't good enough.

But then I guess they don't need to have a reason, it's all God's doing.
And we all know God's real =o

__________________

Ems

1) Like fuck am I related to you.
2) I'm adopted and i wasn't 'claimed'. Ta very much. I'm not a fucking comodity to be passed about as you please.
3)God is a hermaphrodite.
4) God is a bit of a cunt really. Its like blackmail. If you fuck other men you're not allowed into my kingdom. Fuck off.
5) I don't have to obey anyone, let alone my husband, if/when i get married we can be equals, and if thats not the case he can get stuffed mate.
6) The bible was written by some crackwhore who went and got off his face in the pub one night. How can you prove i'm not right eh?

[quote=mychemigirl;382489Last week, I felt something inside of me. It was odd, strange…calming. I knew it was God. I’ve been a Christian since I was three, and I’ve never felt anything like this…ever. I never did at Hume Lake, I never did at church, I never did at Bible study. It was random—unexpected—but I knew exactly what it was. It was God—no doubt about it. Guys, when you get that feeling, it’s the best thing in the world. You feel like you can conquer the world with God, fly to the stars with God… it’s fantastic. It’s like a breeze just blew through your soul and washed away all your worries. It’s kind of hard to explain, but I just felt at peace. I felt calm and placid. I felt happy[/QUOTE]

7)That feeling is caused by chemical imbalances in the brain. You can also get it from taking hallucinogenic drugs. Try it.

Also do you believe in the God of classical theism? Because theres no fucking way any 'being' or whatever you want to call it can be benevolent omniscient, and omnipresent all at the same time. Hell god can't even manage one, feel free to attempt to convince me otherwise.

And I don't need helping. I'll be happy in hell, because everyone I know will be there too. Not that I believe in it but whatever.

__________________

Queen of TBP.net '08

Most Loveable & Most likely to get stranded on a desert island; TBP Yearbook '08

dont~do~it and trust_me: the ultimate observers and comentators of the fan fic world

mychemigirl

How much proof do you want, Richard? You said it yourself: God is real. The Bible says that God does not lie, and if all that you read is true, what more could you ask for?

A college did the math: for eight of the prophecies in the Old Testament to be fulfilled in one man, it would take one man out of 100,000,000,000,000 for it to be even possible. And that's just eight. Jesus fulfilled hundreds.

Is that enough scientific/mathematical proof for you?

__________________



The sun goes down…